Kyle Flanagan & the coach

[Justadragon]

I will also add Bennett knocked us back in 2011, after winning the comp in 2010 and had us leading the comp in 2011. I think he has knocked us back on at least another 2 occasions since then.

We went went all in to sign Bellamy many years ago, and he knocked us back then.

Bennett knocked us back because we didn't give him 5 years in the first place, he made arrangements with Tinkler. Thankyou Mr Doust !!

 

[Justadragon]

To start the season we have
Canterbury at Vegas
Melbourne at Wollongong
Parra at Parra
Gold Coast at Gold Coast
Nth Qld at Kogarah
Manly at Wollongong
Souths at Homebush
Easts at the Football Stadium
Newy at Wollongong
Penrith as Brisbane
Warriors at Kogarah

How many of those games does anyone think we will start favourites in or are expected to win by non Saints fans. I keep saying put things into perspective. When we have a roster that we are "expected" to win games, then judge Flanno. Right now anything above last is exceeding bookies and non Saints fans expectations.

Its not about winning or losing Frank its how competitive we are, Did you notice the way we finished off our season last year ? I certainly dont want to see a repeat of that to start the season. And for interest sake just IMO i would expect to win at least 4 of those games you listed but be damned competitive in all of them.

 

[Dragons Chris]

Flanno hasn't had the cattle to make the top 8. We have been either favourites for the spoon or second favourites for the spoon ever since and before Flanno took over. Can't you see how many other coaches knocked us back? Doesn't that indicate we were not an attractive proposition for good coaches. We even advertised for coaching applicants and Young and Hornby were the only 2 who applied. As Phil Gould said, in his end of season review in 2019. Our problems were not the coach. He said we lacked leadership. Flanno identified that and signed Gutho, Cook and Holmes for leadership. We have got a new CEO and a new recruitment officer. I have also pointed out that teams such as Canberra, Newcastle, Nth Qld, Gold Coast and New Zealand have not been attractive destinations for in demand players. Let Flanno fix our mess and then let him have success, that no other decent prospective coaches wanted the job. It would be a shame for Flanno to lay the groundwork and then for someone else to come in and reap the rewards for his work.

Still no one can tell me who we should or could have signed to make our team stronger that would have come to play for us. Flanno took the job hardly anyone wanted and even I wouldn't have taken the job, because I thought it would have been coaching career suicide, like it was for the last 3 coaches who coached us. Flanno is the best coach we could have got and will prove it in the next few years.

I agree. But that is the team he has assembled. He has no one to blame but himself. Up to now he's had excuses. But from round 1 this year, he needs to show consistent improvement. Better line speed, better long kicking, more creativity from the halves. That isn't in one of two games but consistently. Otherwise if he isn't under a lot of pressure and facing the sack at the back end of the year, the club is still managed by losers who only care about their own positions.

 

[GCRV]

Acko is only on 500K a year. There are players who haven't even played first grade who are on that or more. He certainly isn't a highly paid half and allows us to sign a real "highly paid" half to play along side him or even 2 highly paid halves, if we could get 2 highly paid halves to sign with us.

I didn't say he was a highly paid half. I said if he is going to be a highly paid half.

 

[GCRV]

I agree. But that is the team he has assembled. He has no one to blame but himself. Up to now he's had excuses. But from round 1 this year, he needs to show consistent improvement. Better line speed, better long kicking, more creativity from the halves. That isn't in one of two games but consistently. Otherwise if he isn't under a lot of pressure and facing the sack at the back end of the year, the club is still managed by losers who only care about their own positions.

This year is a rebuilding year. The only way to get worse is the spoon in which case he'll surely be sacked. But to make the 8 we will need Atkinson to be a really good halfback and need the young forwards to punch above their weight. Plus a bit of luck on the injury front. I'm thinking just outside the 8 is a pass mark for this year. In the 8 would be exceeding expectations.

 

[Frank Facer]

I hope you are right Frank , but the other side of the coin is no other club wanted Flanno either. I also do seem to recall that Flanno spent considerable time at the Dragons as an assistant and recruiting officer. What did we have to show for that period of time he was there?

I do recall hearing/reading players talk of him helping their game or development. He is a premiership winning coach.

 

[Frank Facer]

surely you cant compare Atkinson to Luai, a multi premiership winning 5/8 to a player who has been in 1st grade only because of injuries. I would think for Atkinson $500k was a damned good start. I hope Atkinson stars for us and I would have no problem in a contract upgrade, until then he is an unknown entity.

Lets wait until the end of the season and then compare Atkinson with Luai. I haven't seen that much of Atkinson, but I was happy Cronulla chose to keep Trindall and let Atkinson go on the market. I wanted us to sign him. When Luai was on the market, I didn't want us to sign him. I recall reading on another forum, some posters saying we should have signed Luai. I think Luai is over rated and very over paid. I will say, when I first saw Luai play, in a game of NSW Cup against us, I was impressed with him. He played very well in that game and I gave him a wrap. He was a bit lighter and more nibble then. That was before he played first grade. He had the luxury of playing in a champion Penrith team and outside the best halfback in the game.

I am hoping Walker and Reed prove to be exceptional and become our long term halves, but I am also hoping Atkinson has a great year. Think back to when we had Brett Firman playing halfback for us and playing very well, but then Matty Head got an opportunity in first grade and performed even better, Firman became our second string halfback and was let go.

Does anyone think Luai will win a premiership with Wests? I don't. I think Galvin will prove to be better than Luai too.

 

[Frank Facer]

I hope you are right Frank , but the other side of the coin is no other club wanted Flanno either. I also do seem to recall that Flanno spent considerable time at the Dragons as an assistant and recruiting officer. What did we have to show for that period of time he was there?

If you are correct in saying no club wanted Flanno, then we should be very thankful, because if they did, we wouldn't have him and again who were our other options?

Remember when Bennett coached Redcliff in their first season. The bookies had them as favourites for the spoon. That was because of the roster he had on paper.

 

[Dragon David]

I hope you are right Frank , but the other side of the coin is no other club wanted Flanno either. I also do seem to recall that Flanno spent considerable time at the Dragons as an assistant and recruiting officer. What did we have to show for that period of time he was there?

Very true.

 

[Frank Facer]

I didn't say he was a highly paid half. I said if he is going to be a highly paid half.

Sorry, I misinterpreted your post. It may depend on how good Reed and Walker turn out to be, for him to be our long term half or 5/8. Atkinson may prove to be a very good signing, but the Reed and Walker may turn out to be future stars and better than Atkinson. I hold high hopes for Reed and Walker. Maybe we will sign a top line young half such as Purdue or Katoa? Imagine that.

Atkinson was stuck behind the likes of Hughes and Munster at Melbourne who are both top shelf. When he got a chance at Cronulla he did look good, but as I have pointed out many a time, the good ones usually are playing first grade in their teens. Cody Walker and Nicho Hynes are 2 very good examples of halves who didn't establish themselves as good first graders until after 22 years old and were both from Melbourne.

 

[Frank Facer]

Bennett knocked us back because we didn't give him 5 years in the first place, he made arrangements with Tinkler. Thankyou Mr Doust !!

To me, that statement is a load of BS. We wanted to re sign him and for big money, but he didn't want to stay and be our coach, after being very successful as our coach for 2 and half years. Most other coaches would have been happy to re sign and continue to build on what they had built. Bennett was happy to coach Brisbane from 1988 to 2008. He wanted to go elsewhere. South Sydney apparently came very close to signing him. He could have re signed with us and been our long term coach. Tell me which other coaches have got 5 year deals? Did Bennett ever get a 5 year coaching deal anywhere else?

 

[Frank Facer]

Its not about winning or losing Frank its how competitive we are, Did you notice the way we finished off our season last year ? I certainly dont want to see a repeat of that to start the season. And for interest sake just IMO i would expect to win at least 4 of those games you listed but be damned competitive in all of them.

Can you tell us all which of those game you expect us to win? It isn't a coin toss or heads or tails. Right now, which of those games would the bookies have us favourites to win?

As for last year. We finished the year with Toby Couchman, Holmes, Egan, Stewart, Suli and Ryan Couchman all sidelined for much of the backend of last season. We had to play Lawrie. We had rookies such as Halangahu, Buchanan, Pasifiki Tonga and King Togia all playing in those end of season games and we started the year off as favourites for the spoon. Again put things into perspective. Which games at the end of last year did you expect us to win, with all of those players out and those rookies in?

BTW before Flanno took over we had only made the semis once in 12 years and there wasn't any light at the end of the tunnel. That is one of the worst stats any club NRL club would have. Now I do see a light at the end of the tunnel, but it will take another year or to for that light to come on and hopefully some of our youngsters such as Reed, Walker, Phar Lap, Halangahu, etc live up to our hopes and are playing in a top 4 team.

 

[Justadragon]

If you are correct in saying no club wanted Flanno, then we should be very thankful, because if they did, we wouldn't have him and again who were our other options?

Remember when Bennett coached Redcliff in their first season. The bookies had them as favourites for the spoon. That was because of the roster he had on paper.

In my personal opinion I would have offered something to Ryan Carr

 

[Justadragon]

To me, that statement is a load of BS. We wanted to re sign him and for big money, but he didn't want to stay and be our coach, after being very successful as our coach for 2 and half years. Most other coaches would have been happy to re sign and continue to build on what they had built. Bennett was happy to coach Brisbane from 1988 to 2008. He wanted to go elsewhere. South Sydney apparently came very close to signing him. He could have re signed with us and been our long term coach. Tell me which other coaches have got 5 year deals? Did Bennett ever get a 5 year coaching deal anywhere else?

He wanted 5 years from the start and the Dragons said no. What more can I tell you. When they wanted to re-sign him Tinkler had already tapped him up for bigger money. Bennett could do that, Flanno could not.

 

[Justadragon]

Can you tell us all which of those game you expect us to win? It isn't a coin toss or heads or tails. Right now, which of those games would the bookies have us favourites to win?

As for last year. We finished the year with Toby Couchman, Holmes, Egan, Stewart, Suli and Ryan Couchman all sidelined for much of the backend of last season. We had to play Lawrie. We had rookies such as Halangahu, Buchanan, Pasifiki Tonga and King Togia all playing in those end of season games and we started the year off as favourites for the spoon. Again put things into perspective. Which games at the end of last year did you expect us to win, with all of those players out and those rookies in?

BTW before Flanno took over we had only made the semis once in 12 years and there wasn't any light at the end of the tunnel. That is one of the worst stats any club NRL club would have. Now I do see a light at the end of the tunnel, but it will take another year or to for that light to come on and hopefully some of our youngsters such as Reed, Walker, Phar Lap, Halangahu, etc live up to our hopes and are playing in a top 4 team.

As I said before Frank I dont care who the bookies have as favorites and I dont care what non saints fans think, All that matters to me is what I see, last year I saw a team that gave up regardless of who we had there. There needs to be some massive improvement in our style of game, it doesn't matter who we have, you dont have to have a team of stars.
As for perspective, you will recall the game against Souths, where they practically had 3/4 of their side out. You will recall the embarrassing 40-0 thrashing, you will also recall the lack of being competitive no matter who we had

 

[Dragon David]

As I said before Frank I dont care who the bookies have as favorites and I dont care what non saints fans think, All that matters to me is what I see, last year I saw a team that gave up regardless of who we had there. There needs to be some massive improvement in our style of game, it doesn't matter who we have, you dont have to have a team of stars.
As for perspective, you will recall the game against Souths, where they practically had 3/4 of their side out. You will recall the embarrassing 40-0 thrashing, you will also recall the lack of being competitive no matter who we had

Yes, such a terrible game by the Dragons against a virtual ressie Souths side.

‘I’ll become one of the weak ones’: Flanno pressed on ref shockers in Dragons’ horror loss

‘I’ll become one of the weak ones’: Flanno pressed on ref shockers in Dragons’ horror loss

www.foxsports.com.au

 

[Dragons Chris]

Yes, such a terrible game by the Dragons against a virtual ressie Souths side.

‘I’ll become one of the weak ones’: Flanno pressed on ref shockers in Dragons’ horror loss

‘I’ll become one of the weak ones’: Flanno pressed on ref shockers in Dragons’ horror loss

www.foxsports.com.au

I thought Braith Anasta's comments on the Fox NRL podcast were very fair. The only way for Kyle and Atkinson to shut up the critics is to start winning a lot more games.

 

[GCRV]

I thought Braith Anasta's comments on the Fox NRL podcast were very fair. The only way for Kyle and Atkinson to shut up the critics is to start winning a lot more games.

Same for every halves combination in the competition. Though yeah, a bit more pressure on our halves than most others. Or all others. GC halves will be under the spotlight, whoever they end up going with and I'm guessing it won't be Ilias. Brown at Newcastle will be under huge pressure.

 

[Dragons Chris]

Even though I've just spent about 36 hours explaining why Reed needs his year (or 2) in cup... the lack of hooker depth (even if Cook/HFinau stay fit) is a real dilemma, and I have to admit that Kyle doing say 25mins at 9 is almost the only conventional fallback option left.. and that means Atko/Reed in the halves, again for atleast part of the match.

But changing your halves right now after a full season is madness.. it would only be forced due to the hooker crisis.. which tbh im amazed weve let ourselves get to this point.. I thought for sure we would have recruited a quality young 9... even an experienced one for a 12mth contract.. Connor is likely to miss the majority of the season.

I think you mean after a full pre-season. Sounds right. Why has Flanno had that duo training in the halves all off season? Didn't he say one of the two was recruited to play #14? Did he lie and are we just accepting that?

 

[Dragons Chris]

This will be very interesting. I think we all know Flanno was lying when he said Kyle was recruited to play #14. He told Bud Sullivan he wasn't wanted after it was certain Amone was going to stood down at best. Seems he lied to the CEO when asked about it as well. But now does he have any choice but to try Kyle at hooker?

Now looking forward to all the flaming of me for bringing it up again but no one to say any of the above isn't true. How did it come to this? Such an amateur club where the head coach is allowed to play his boy simply because he is the head coaches boy.