Coach Griffin

Eric

Eric

Staff

All St George Illawarra Dragons fans want is a team that can play football​

Paul McGregor was a very good player, a lovely guy by all reports, but a very ordinary rugby league coach, and how he got control of St George Illawarra Dragons first-grade team for seven long seasons is one of life’s mysteries. For most of McGregor’s tenure Saints played what I’ve like to call ‘Maryball’. Essentially it’s a style of football that left everything to the imagination and was predictable to a fault.
  • It's not a mystery. It's just good ol incompetence along with some vested interests and internal politics.
  • I like the term "Maryball".
  • Very unimaginative indeed
  • I understand old habits die hard but it's getting really old now. There is no first grade or reserve grade anymore. There is only NRL and NSW Cup.
Now, predictable and unimaginative football can be successful in the right hands, as evidenced by the success of Warren Ryan’s ‘Wazzaball’ back in the 1980s, but not so with Mary, as his one-out-hit-up tactics saw the Dragons finish in an average of tenth place over his time at the helm and play just three finals matches in seven years. Player skills actually regressed under McGregor.
  • To be fair, a few players, like 2 or 3 over seven years of hell credited Baldy with making them better players.
Fast-forward to 2021 and McGregor’s gone, Anthony Griffin is in the coach’s chair and things are starting off reasonably well with the team playing some enterprising football for a change. Then it all came unstuck after Round 17 when Paul Vaughan convened a meeting of Dragons dimwits around his Weber. Saints immediately fell in a heap and reverted once again to the familiar Maryball style of play, with Corey Norman seemingly its greatest exponent, and went on to finish the year in 12th place. Dragon’s fans were over it.
  • Yes, they were stupid.
  • Yes, the rules were utterly illogical. It's ok to play and train for a contact sport together but not to have a BBQ.......
  • But please stop. It's really too old now.
The Saints faithful were then treated to Hook’s own version of moneyball in the 2021 off-season, when virtually any NRL player on JobKeeper was taken in at Kogarah with the promise of a full-time salary.
  • A few people were scratching their heads, including me.
 
Eric

Eric

Staff

Part II​

At the same time, another very strange thing happened, as St George Illawarra somehow retained most of their crop of emerging talented youngsters for a change. These emerging players – Jayden Sullivan, Talatau Amone, Tyrell Sloan, Cody Ramsey, Shalom O’Ofou and the Feagai twins Matt and Max – have already demonstrated in their limited first-grade appearances that they are footballers who like to play what’s in front of them, let the ball do the talking and take the opposition on. They all look like naturals to me.
  • Well, O'Ofou hasn't made his NRL debut yet and won't until at least round 10.
  • Other than that, it is an impressive batch.
So what I’m hoping for from Anthony Griffin this year is that he abandons the conservative style of football of the past, lets these young guys loose on the opposition and gives the team his blessing to play attractive attacking football.
  • Nonsense. There is an area between conservative and playing all out attacking football which is best.
So here’s the team I think Griffin should trot out in Round 1. It’s a team capable of playing attacking football and causing the opposition some real headaches.
  1. Tyrell Sloan: a great up-and-coming fullback talent.
  2. Mikaele Ravalawa: a weapon on the flank who can both score tries and return the ball from his own end.
  3. Zac Lomax: still only 22 and a wonderful attacking centre.
  4. Moses Suli: a backline giant who will terrorise the opposition.
  5. Matt Feagai: a powerful winger who knows the way to the line.
  6. Talatau Amone: he has all the skills and is a threat every time he has the ball.
  7. Jayden Sullivan: elusive, quick and a perfect foil for Amone.
  8. Blake Lawrie: a hard-running player who never backs off.
  9. Ben Hunt: a very experienced player in the best form of his career who can set the standard from dummy half.
  10. Josh Kerr: a very mobile front rower with good ball skills.
  11. Jack Bird: adds speed and ball skills to the back row.
  12. Jaydn Su’A: a rugged player who loves to take the opposition on.
  13. Jack se Belin: still one of the best locks in the game and can create opportunities in the middle of the ruck.
  14. Moses Mbye: an experienced performer who can cover dummy half and every backline position.
  15. Francis Molo: a wrecking ball who already has Origin experience.
  16. Tariq Sims: can add value either on the edge or as a middle forward if required.
  17. Aaron Woods: can still produce the goods and has a high work rate.
  • Surely Josh Kerr is way behind several others. He is mobile though I haven't seen of his good ball skills. So Woods in for Kerr, Burgess on the bench. Bird or Sims starting is I know a matter of contention around here.
 
GCRV

GCRV

SGI NSW Cup
Eric said:

All St George Illawarra fans want is a team that can play football​

Paul McGregor was a very good player, a lovely guy by all reports, but a very ordinary rugby league coach, and how he got control of St George Illawarra Dragons first-grade team for seven long seasons is one of life’s mysteries. For most of McGregor’s tenure Saints played what I’ve like to call ‘Maryball’. Essentially it’s a style of football that left everything to the imagination and was predictable to a fault.
  • It's not a mystery. It's just good ol incompetence along with some vested interests and internal politics.
  • I like the term "Maryball".
  • Very unimaginative indeed
  • I understand old habits die hard but it's getting really old now. There is no first grade or reserve grade anymore. There is only NRL and NSW Cup.
Now, predictable and unimaginative football can be successful in the right hands, as evidenced by the success of Warren Ryan’s ‘Wazzaball’ back in the 1980s, but not so with Mary, as his one-out-hit-up tactics saw the Dragons finish in an average of tenth place over his time at the helm and play just three finals matches in seven years. Player skills actually regressed under McGregor.
  • To be fair, a few players, like 2 or 3 over seven years of hell credited Baldy with making them better players.
Fast-forward to 2021 and McGregor’s gone, Anthony Griffin is in the coach’s chair and things are starting off reasonably well with the team playing some enterprising football for a change. Then it all came unstuck after Round 17 when Paul Vaughan convened a meeting of Dragons dimwits around his Weber. Saints immediately fell in a heap and reverted once again to the familiar Maryball style of play, with Corey Norman seemingly its greatest exponent, and went on to finish the year in 12th place. Dragon’s fans were over it.
  • Yes, they were stupid.
  • Yes, the rules were utterly illogical. It's ok to play and train for a contact sport together but not to have a BBQ.......
  • But please stop. It's really too old now.
The Saints faithful were then treated to Hook’s own version of moneyball in the 2021 off-season, when virtually any NRL player on JobKeeper was taken in at Kogarah with the promise of a full-time salary.
  • A few people were scratching their heads, including me.
Click to expand...
Saints are by far the most patient club with underperforming coaches. It wasn't only McGregor.
 
Morgan

Morgan

SGI NSW Cup
Eric said:
So here’s the team I think Griffin should trot out in Round 1. It’s a team capable of playing attacking football and causing the opposition some real headaches.
  1. Tyrell Sloan: a great up-and-coming fullback talent.
  2. Mikaele Ravalawa: a weapon on the flank who can both score tries and return the ball from his own end.
  3. Zac Lomax: still only 22 and a wonderful attacking centre.
  4. Moses Suli: a backline giant who will terrorise the opposition.
  5. Matt Feagai: a powerful winger who knows the way to the line.
  6. Talatau Amone: he has all the skills and is a threat every time he has the ball.
  7. Jayden Sullivan: elusive, quick and a perfect foil for Amone.
  8. Blake Lawrie: a hard-running player who never backs off.
  9. Ben Hunt: a very experienced player in the best form of his career who can set the standard from dummy half.
  10. Josh Kerr: a very mobile front rower with good ball skills.
  11. Jack Bird: adds speed and ball skills to the back row.
  12. Jaydn Su’A: a rugged player who loves to take the opposition on.
  13. Jack se Belin: still one of the best locks in the game and can create opportunities in the middle of the ruck.
  14. Moses Mbye: an experienced performer who can cover dummy half and every backline position.
  15. Francis Molo: a wrecking ball who already has Origin experience.
  16. Tariq Sims: can add value either on the edge or as a middle forward if required.
  17. Aaron Woods: can still produce the goods and has a high work rate.
  • Surely Josh Kerr is way behind several others. He is mobile though I haven't seen of his good ball skills. So Woods in for Kerr, Burgess on the bench. Bird or Sims starting is I know a matter of contention around here.
Click to expand...
Well, this team looks like it's the wishful thinking of someone who doesn't want St George to win. The mistake about O'Ofuo shows the author doesn't have a great idea about the club.

At this point, it seems obvious Ramsey is in front of Feagai.
Hunt will start at 7 and McCullough at 9. Even if McCullough is injured or suspended, Muhleisen will go straight into 9. Sullivan will be 6 or 7 in the event of injury or suspension to Hunt or Amone.

And as you said about Josh Kerr.
 
Eric

Eric

Staff
Morgan said:
Well, this team looks like it's the wishful thinking of someone who doesn't want St George to win. The mistake about O'Ofuo shows the author doesn't have a great idea about the club.

At this point, it seems obvious Ramsey is in front of Feagai.
Hunt will start at 7 and McCullough at 9. Even if McCullough is injured or suspended, Muhleisen will go straight into 9. Sullivan will be 6 or 7 in the event of injury or suspension to Hunt or Amone.

And as you said about Josh Kerr.
Click to expand...
You're right. I didn't even notice the Ben Hunt and Sullivan thing. I should have guessed after the O'Ofuo comment. The good news is that this time next week, all the speculation will be over. As far as I can see, the only contention here is whether Sims or Bird will start in the second row. I'm on the fence. My opinion changes by the hour.
 
jodragon40

jodragon40

Staff
Eric said:
You're right. I didn't even notice the Ben Hunt and Sullivan thing. I should have guessed after the O'Ofuo comment. The good news is that this time next week, all the speculation will be over. As far as I can see, the only contention here is whether Sims or Bird will start in the second row. I'm on the fence. My opinion changes by the hour.
Click to expand...
Bird
 
Chris M

Chris M

SGI NSW Cup
jodragon40 said:
Bird
Click to expand...
Eric said:
You're right. I didn't even notice the Ben Hunt and Sullivan thing. I should have guessed after the O'Ofuo comment. The good news is that this time next week, all the speculation will be over. As far as I can see, the only contention here is whether Sims or Bird will start in the second row. I'm on the fence. My opinion changes by the hour.
Click to expand...
I'm going with Sims.
 
Morgan

Morgan

SGI NSW Cup
This was always going to happen after the last 2 games and the performance of the young players in the club. He has recruited poorly. What did we need Moses Mbye for? Jack Bird is a utility and Connor Muhleisen is ready for first grade now.

ANTHONY GRIFFIN UNDER PRESSURE AFTER DRAGONS’ HORROR STREAK​

For all the heat on the Wests Tigers about the club’s 0-4 start to the season it’s worth remembering St George Illawarra have only won two out of the club’s last 13 matches – both against the Warriors. Dragons coach Anthony Griffin’s call to axe young gun playmakers Tyrell Sloan and Junior Amone has created plenty of waves around the game after the Red V outfit was completely outclassed against Parramatta in round four.

There’s a view from some of the NRL’s best retired playmakers dropping Sloan to the NSW Cup and Amone to the bench will only dent the confidence of two of the NRL’s best emerging playmakers. There’s also a view as much as they’re young and they’ll make mistakes they’re also prepared to take risks and add a genuine x-factor edge to the Dragons attack.

St George Illawarra have done well to overhaul the Red V roster and showed genuine signs they were going to be a side on the rise this year. But after three consecutive losses and two heavy defeats at the hands of Cronulla and Parramatta D-day is fast approaching. The Dragons made the early call and extended the contract of coach Griffin until the end of 2023 over the summer to avoid the question being raised this year. There’s a hell of a lot riding on the Dragons clash with South Sydney on Super Saturday. The Red V need to show some fight.
 
RedV01

RedV01

SGI NSW Cup
Morgan said:
This was always going to happen after the last 2 games and the performance of the young players in the club. He has recruited poorly. What did we need Moses Mbye for? Jack Bird is a utility and Connor Muhleisen is ready for first grade now.

ANTHONY GRIFFIN UNDER PRESSURE AFTER DRAGONS’ HORROR STREAK​

For all the heat on the Wests Tigers about the club’s 0-4 start to the season it’s worth remembering St George Illawarra have only won two out of the club’s last 13 matches – both against the Warriors. Dragons coach Anthony Griffin’s call to axe young gun playmakers Tyrell Sloan and Junior Amone has created plenty of waves around the game after the Red V outfit was completely outclassed against Parramatta in round four.

There’s a view from some of the NRL’s best retired playmakers dropping Sloan to the NSW Cup and Amone to the bench will only dent the confidence of two of the NRL’s best emerging playmakers. There’s also a view as much as they’re young and they’ll make mistakes they’re also prepared to take risks and add a genuine x-factor edge to the Dragons attack.

St George Illawarra have done well to overhaul the Red V roster and showed genuine signs they were going to be a side on the rise this year. But after three consecutive losses and two heavy defeats at the hands of Cronulla and Parramatta D-day is fast approaching. The Dragons made the early call and extended the contract of coach Griffin until the end of 2023 over the summer to avoid the question being raised this year. There’s a hell of a lot riding on the Dragons clash with South Sydney on Super Saturday. The Red V need to show some fight.
Click to expand...
It's way too early to blame him for the (possible) lack of young players coming though. I read somewhere that if 2 or 3 players come though every year, that is ample. I agree with that. I'd say 2 is ample. Next year obviously everyone is saying Connor Muhleisen. Hopefully Jackson Shereb and maybe Josh Coric. No one else is looking likely. Obviously the two Feagai's have already made it into the NRL along with Amone, Sloan and Sullivan.
 
Chris M

Chris M

SGI NSW Cup
Morgan said:
This was always going to happen after the last 2 games and the performance of the young players in the club. He has recruited poorly. What did we need Moses Mbye for? Jack Bird is a utility and Connor Muhleisen is ready for first grade now.

ANTHONY GRIFFIN UNDER PRESSURE AFTER DRAGONS’ HORROR STREAK​

For all the heat on the Wests Tigers about the club’s 0-4 start to the season it’s worth remembering St George Illawarra have only won two out of the club’s last 13 matches – both against the Warriors. Dragons coach Anthony Griffin’s call to axe young gun playmakers Tyrell Sloan and Junior Amone has created plenty of waves around the game after the Red V outfit was completely outclassed against Parramatta in round four.

There’s a view from some of the NRL’s best retired playmakers dropping Sloan to the NSW Cup and Amone to the bench will only dent the confidence of two of the NRL’s best emerging playmakers. There’s also a view as much as they’re young and they’ll make mistakes they’re also prepared to take risks and add a genuine x-factor edge to the Dragons attack.

St George Illawarra have done well to overhaul the Red V roster and showed genuine signs they were going to be a side on the rise this year. But after three consecutive losses and two heavy defeats at the hands of Cronulla and Parramatta D-day is fast approaching. The Dragons made the early call and extended the contract of coach Griffin until the end of 2023 over the summer to avoid the question being raised this year. There’s a hell of a lot riding on the Dragons clash with South Sydney on Super Saturday. The Red V need to show some fight.
Click to expand...
He deserves to see out the end of this season but if there hasn't been a huge improvement after the SOO period, probably time to start looking for a replacement. I wonder if Shane Flanagan will still be available. Because it's looking like old boys Trent Barrett and Nathan Brown might struggle to see out the year.
 
GCRV

GCRV

SGI NSW Cup
I'm curious as to why Amone's form has fallen off a cliff this season. Is he having problems with the coach? The coach is telling him to play super conservative?
 
jodragon40

jodragon40

Staff
Coaches head already on the chopping block. Bearing in mind that non of us are privy to the goings on within the club so you should only comment on the current facts not what your personal beliefs may be. The facts indicate that the club is in a mess once again. The coach is really responsible for retention and recruitment of players plus on match day the tactics used and the 17 selected to represent the club. The facts indicate that we are failing in multiple areas both on and off the field. The question is who shoulders the responsibility for these failures. If you believe it's the coach then he must go. Don't forget once again we have extended a coach who presently has failed to lift our club from a 10 yr doldrums with no end in sight at the moment but it's only round 5. There needs to be an improved showing no later than round 9 otherwise this will be another lost season in my humble view
 
GCRV

GCRV

SGI NSW Cup
jodragon40 said:
Coaches head already on the chopping block. Bearing in mind that non of us are privy to the goings on within the club so you should only comment on the current facts not what your personal beliefs may be. The facts indicate that the club is in a mess once again. The coach is really responsible for retention and recruitment of players plus on match day the tactics used and the 17 selected to represent the club. The facts indicate that we are failing in multiple areas both on and off the field. The question is who shoulders the responsibility for these failures. If you believe it's the coach then he must go. Don't forget once again we have extended a coach who presently has failed to lift our club from a 10 yr doldrums with no end in sight at the moment but it's only round 5. There needs to be an improved showing no later than round 9 otherwise this will be another lost season in my humble view
Click to expand...
It's pretty hard to argue against any of this. Unfortunately. There were such high hopes after the form of Amone and Sloan late last year. The middle forwards were a worry but both Molo and Woods have been good. Ditto for de Belin.

The team should be much better and someone has to answer for the fact it isn't!
 
RedV01

RedV01

SGI NSW Cup
jodragon40 said:
Coaches head already on the chopping block. Bearing in mind that non of us are privy to the goings on within the club so you should only comment on the current facts not what your personal beliefs may be. The facts indicate that the club is in a mess once again. The coach is really responsible for retention and recruitment of players plus on match day the tactics used and the 17 selected to represent the club. The facts indicate that we are failing in multiple areas both on and off the field. The question is who shoulders the responsibility for these failures. If you believe it's the coach then he must go. Don't forget once again we have extended a coach who presently has failed to lift our club from a 10 yr doldrums with no end in sight at the moment but it's only round 5. There needs to be an improved showing no later than round 9 otherwise this will be another lost season in my humble view
Click to expand...
Well said.
 
jodragon40

jodragon40

Staff
GCRV said:
I'm curious as to why Amone's form has fallen off a cliff this season. Is he having problems with the coach? The coach is telling him to play super conservative?
Click to expand...
I said in a previous post he appeared to be playing to the coaches instructions. However if that was the case why was he dropped?
 
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