Round 4 vs Parramatta

[Morgan]

Yep, 100%. I must admit, going with this team really doesn't seem like any kind of coaching masterstroke. It seems obvious. Though I'd leave McCullough on for around 35min and bring him after around 5min of the second half. A 20min halftime break is ample for him.

What do you think of my idea of having your man Gosiewski start if Woods and Molo are the starting props and De Belin the starting lock. Eric's idea with Sims starting rather than Gosiewski would mean the starting pack has gone from being too small to being massive.

I like that idea as well.

Sounds like an idea but it might also be an idea to start Sims and Gosiewski with Bird on the bench.

In the new regime, reputations are supposed to be unimportant compared to form.

Or that idea.

 

[jodragon40]

Yep, 100%. I must admit, going with this team really doesn't seem like any kind of coaching masterstroke. It seems obvious. Though I'd leave McCullough on for around 35min and bring him after around 5min of the second half. A 20min halftime break is ample for him.

What do you think of my idea of having your man Gosiewski start if Woods and Molo are the starting props and De Belin the starting lock. Eric's idea with Sims starting rather than Gosiewski would mean the starting pack has gone from being too small to being massive.

Could work Sims hasn't got his heart in it last year and so far this year . I always put my best tackling forward as lock and Debelin is exactly that. Just hope the coach is bluffing with the named starting 13

 

[GCRV]

Could work Sims hasn't got his heart in it last year and so far this year . I always put my best tackling forward as lock and Debelin is exactly that. Just hope the coach is bluffing with the named starting 13

I don't think Sims has been kicking stones in his 2 games so far this year. I think the team isn't getting the best from him because he's playing out of position.

 

[Chris M]

I don't think Sims has been kicking stones in his 2 games so far this year. I think the team isn't getting the best from him because he's playing out of position.

Agree with that. Jack de Belin starting from the bench is playing him out of position as well. Over to you Hook. Simple fix. Make it happen or start looking for new employment.

 

[Chris M]

Just one more thought on Sunday's game. The Parra forwards are way better than the Dragons pack named (but we all hope will be changed significantly) but I think our backs are also way better. Particularly if Sloan and Amone pull thier socks up this week.

 

[jodragon40]

Just one more thought on Sunday's game. The Parra forwards are way better than the Dragons pack named (but we all hope will be changed significantly) but I think our backs are also way better. Particularly if Sloan and Amone pull thier socks up this week.

Won't matter if they don't get a chance

 

[Chris M]

Won't matter if they don't get a chance

True that. Not if they are only used to make the hard yards coming out of the Dragons own end.

And still one more thought. Looking forward to seeing what Feagai can do.

 

[Morgan]

Penrith second rowers:

• Kikau = about 120kg
• Martin = about 105kg

St George Illawarra second rowers:

• Bird = about 95kg
• Gosiewski = about 95kg

Why doesn't Hook tell Cleary how much better small second rowers are?

 

[jodragon40]

Penrith second rowers:

• Kikau = about 120kg
• Martin = about 105kg

St George Illawarra second rowers:

• Bird = about 95kg
• Gosiewski = about 95kg

Why doesn't Hook tell Cleary how much better small second rowers are?

You know I can live with that stat. I have found in my time that although in the forwards size does matter on a whole those players still need to have the ability . As the old saying goes its the size of the fight in the dog not the size of the dog. Don't forget back in my day scrums were still contested and it was embarrassing to be pushed backwards especially when you had the feed. It was in my era that they stopped contesting scrums and that's when clubs started to look at smaller more mobile backrowers

 

[RedV01]

You know I can live with that stat. I have found in my time that although in the forwards size does matter on a whole those players still need to have the ability . As the old saying goes its the size of the fight in the dog not the size of the dog. Don't forget back in my day scrums were still contested and it was embarrassing to be pushed backwards especially when you had the feed. It was in my era that they stopped contesting scrums and that's when clubs started to look at smaller more mobile backrowers

I rate your man Gosiewski and Bird. And Jackson Ford as well. Mbye is good on the bench as injury cover in the backs. Blake Lawrie doesn't pass but he keeps going and going for a prop. Having three of them start with two on the bench just won't cut it in most games. As we have already seen.

 

[Chris M]

You know I can live with that stat. I have found in my time that although in the forwards size does matter on a whole those players still need to have the ability . As the old saying goes its the size of the fight in the dog not the size of the dog. Don't forget back in my day scrums were still contested and it was embarrassing to be pushed backwards especially when you had the feed. It was in my era that they stopped contesting scrums and that's when clubs started to look at smaller more mobile backrowers

I just think Sims and the coach may have fallen out. I think the coach is right. I wish all the Dragons long-term players would get the contract they want but that's impossible. Need to be tough like Melbourne and Sydney Rorters are. Telling Sims this is his last year was the right thing to do for the club. Having said that, I think he's a better second rower than Gosiewski or Bird. An even bigger problem as far as I'm concerned is this ridiculous thing about starting Sims out of position at lock and de Belin on the bench. It's backfired in both games it's been tried. So...... what's going on?

 

[Morgan]

You know I can live with that stat. I have found in my time that although in the forwards size does matter on a whole those players still need to have the ability . As the old saying goes its the size of the fight in the dog not the size of the dog. Don't forget back in my day scrums were still contested and it was embarrassing to be pushed backwards especially when you had the feed. It was in my era that they stopped contesting scrums and that's when clubs started to look at smaller more mobile backrowers

I rate your man Gosiewski and Bird. And Jackson Ford as well. Mbye is good on the bench as injury cover in the backs. Blake Lawrie doesn't pass but he keeps going and going for a prop. Having three of them start with two on the bench just won't cut it in most games. As we have already seen.

I just had a quick look. I don't know every teams second row well but of the ones I know:

• Gold Coast have Fifita and Proctor
• Tigers have Leilua and Tuilagi
• Shonkies also have relatively small second rowers.
• Newcastle have Frizell and someone I have no idea about.
• Penrith mentioned above.
• Souths have Koloamatagai and Arrow
• Warriors have our old boy Aitken and Katoa. Aitken is another small second rower
• Brisbane have Palasia and Riki. I don't know about these two but one is 110kg and one 106kg

I don't want to go through anymore but it seems a second row of Sims and Su'a would be pretty standard as far as how big they are goes. Gosiewski and Bird with Lawrie in the front row and no one really big like Paulo for example, equals a really small pack.

 

[jodragon40]

I rate your man Gosiewski and Bird. And Jackson Ford as well. Mbye is good on the bench as injury cover in the backs. Blake Lawrie doesn't pass but he keeps going and going for a prop. Having three of them start with two on the bench just won't cut it in most games. As we have already seen.

My best rotation selection would be Woods Molo starting props replaced by Lawrie and Burgess you know that Mcguire will get a spot on bench when he returns and have to have Mbye on that bench. Therefore if you have Sims Debelin and Bird as starters you have to drop Gosiewski. Im hoping on form shown so far this season Sims goes.

 

[jodragon40]

I just think Sims and the coach may have fallen out. I think the coach is right. I wish all the Dragons long-term players would get the contract they want but that's impossible. Need to be tough like Melbourne and Sydney Rorters are. Telling Sims this is his last year was the right thing to do for the club. Having said that, I think he's a better second rower than Gosiewski or Bird. An even bigger problem as far as I'm concerned is this ridiculous thing about starting Sims out of position at lock and de Belin on the bench. It's backfired in both games it's been tried. So...... what's going on?

On form so far this season Sims shouldn't be in the 17. Round 6 we see Mcguire and Fumi return then the coaches thought process will be revealed. Debelin is in my view a certain starter at lock he's our best tackler. Bird is coaches favourite so he will continue to start. We need Woods Molo Burgess in the 17 time will tell what the coach thinks

 

[jodragon40]

I just had a quick look. I don't know every teams second row well but of the ones I know:

• Gold Coast have Fifita and Proctor
• Tigers have Leilua and Tuilagi
• Shonkies also have relatively small second rowers.
• Newcastle have Frizell and someone I have no idea about.
• Penrith mentioned above.
• Souths have Koloamatagai and Arrow
• Warriors have our old boy Aitken and Katoa. Aitken is another small second rower
• Brisbane have Palasia and Riki. I don't know about these two but one is 110kg and one 106kg

I don't want to go through anymore but it seems a second row of Sims and Su'a would be pretty standard as far as how big they are goes. Gosiewski and Bird with Lawrie in the front row and no one really big like Paulo for example, equals a really small pack.

Front row in my view needs to include Woods Molo and Burgess as a minimum

 

[Chris M]

On form so far this season Sims shouldn't be in the 17. Round 6 we see Mcguire and Fumi return then the coaches thought process will be revealed. Debelin is in my view a certain starter at lock he's our best tackler. Bird is coaches favourite so he will continue to start. We need Woods Molo Burgess in the 17 time will tell what the coach thinks

I don't disagree with that but he's played 2 games, for around 30min in both, out of position in the middle as opposed to his best position as an 80min edge backrower.

I'm not against both Bird and Gosiewski being in the 17 or even starting but if that's what's going to happen, De Belin at lock and Woods, Molo, Burgess in the 17 is an absolute must otherwise the forwards risk getting trampled by much bigger opposition in every game.

 

[Chris M]

My best rotation selection would be Woods Molo starting props replaced by Lawrie and Burgess you know that Mcguire will get a spot on bench when he returns and have to have Mbye on that bench. Therefore if you have Sims Debelin and Bird as starters you have to drop Gosiewski. Im hoping on form shown so far this season Sims goes.

I like that starting prop and interchange rotation but if all are fit in 2 weeks when McGuire comes back, I think Lawrie, judging by form shown so far this year, will be the one to make way.

 

[Morgan]

On form so far this season Sims shouldn't be in the 17. Round 6 we see Mcguire and Fumi return then the coaches thought process will be revealed. Debelin is in my view a certain starter at lock he's our best tackler. Bird is coaches favourite so he will continue to start. We need Woods Molo Burgess in the 17 time will tell what the coach thinks

I don't think Bird is a coach favourite. I think he's on his way out. To be honest, I was hoping/thinking Bird would be similar to that Pommy second rower at Canberra two seasons back (not the one still there, the one who left with some bad blood between him and the front office). In three games so far this season, that has far from proved to be the case. And I mean that in a bad way. Bird had been a forward weak link in all 3 games. He has done good things in every game but look at his stats. Pretty poor. Against the Shonkies he ran into a half gap in the second half and made about 20 run metres. If not for that, his run metres would have been absolutely atrocious.

 

[Chris M]

I don't think Bird is a coach favourite. I think he's on his way out. To be honest, I was hoping/thinking Bird would be similar to that Pommy second rower at Canberra two seasons back (not the one still there, the one who left with some bad blood between him and the front office). In three games so far this season, that has far from proved to be the case. And I mean that in a bad way. Bird had been a forward weak link in all 3 games. He has done good things in every game but look at his stats. Pretty poor. Against the Shonkies he ran into a half gap in the second half and made about 20 run metres. If not for that, his run metres would have been absolutely atrocious.

I think the name you are looking for is John Bateman.

 

[Eric]

I just had a quick look. I don't know every teams second row well but of the ones I know:

• Gold Coast have Fifita and Proctor
• Tigers have Leilua and Tuilagi
• Shonkies also have relatively small second rowers.
• Newcastle have Frizell and someone I have no idea about.
• Penrith mentioned above.
• Souths have Koloamatagai and Arrow
• Warriors have our old boy Aitken and Katoa. Aitken is another small second rower
• Brisbane have Palasia and Riki. I don't know about these two but one is 110kg and one 106kg

I don't want to go through anymore but it seems a second row of Sims and Su'a would be pretty standard as far as how big they are goes. Gosiewski and Bird with Lawrie in the front row and no one really big like Paulo for example, equals a really small pack.

I think jodragon40 is right. I looked at some of the remaining backrowers you didn't mention. There are some exceptions and a backrow of Bird and Gosiewski is the smallest but not by a lot. A few teams with one just over 100kg and one just under. Similar to Bird and Gosiewski. Blake Lawrie isn't really that small for a prop either but other props around his size like Tapine at Canberra and Thompson at Bullgrubs are very mobile for props and can pass as well. I don't think the problem is Bird, Gosiewski or Lawrie but starting all three along with a backrower at lock is outright stupid.